NATIVE MXF SUPPORT IN FCP...SORTA
Let me first point you to the Apple Discussion thread that prompted this discovery. Full credit goes to ILMSTMF...whoever that is (real name not given, location unknown).
OK...while trying to troubleshoot a frame rate issue, Mr. ILMSTMF did something that shouldn't have worked. He imported an MXF file directly from the Contents folder...and it worked! He got the warning that the file wasn't "optimal," but still, it worked. Since he imported only the video file, there was no audio. He imported that separately and could sync it up.
Now...how the HECK did he do that? I didn't believe it. So I did it myself. Wouldn't you know it...It worked. I got the same message, but it worked. 
When did this happen? When did FCP import MXF files natively? I couldn't figure this out. How did this suddenly happen? And why didn't Apple tell us about this.
Then Wes from Automatic Duck mentioned that he could do this...and he was running the same version. I iChatted with a couple other people and two of them couldn't do it. What was different? When I was looking around I noticed that I had the P2CMS application from Panasonic installed. I asked the guys who couldn't import...they didn't install it. So I went looking in my Quicktime Library and I found this:
Yep...that component...MXFImporter.component...is installed with P2CMS. This is what allows their software to read the MXF footage. With this installed, the MXF files are selectable...without it, they are grey and you can't click on them:
NOW...if Panasonic figured out how to get this working natively, why haven't they licensed it to Apple and let us work with the footage? This is a very valid workflow for many people. I myself still prefer to Log and Import, as I like to rename my footage and organize it, but many many people just want to have instant access to the footage.
OK guys...we are ALMOST there. Just talk to each other and we can get the native support that so many people want.
(not that Apple or Panasonic read this blog...I was just talking metaphorically.)
31 comments:
Hey great find. This kinda reminds me how you can grab a VOB file directly out of a VIDEO_TS folder from a dvd and get it into FCP. It ain't optimal or pretty (and should never be done really) but it can be done!
THAT can be done now? I wonder what QT component allows that...?
P2CMS - version 1.0.0
Mac OS X 10.5.1
I dont find any MXFimporter.component in my qt library.
Am i missing something?
Install P2CMS again. That is the same version I have.
Hi Shane
I installed both the 'P2CMSInstaller' and the 'P2PCCard Install' and one of the two has given me the 'MXFImporter.component', however I can't import my Media Composer MXF files. Something I've missed?
Cancel that, I haven't got fcp6.
And cancel that because this is for Panasonic P2 MXF files, NOT Avid MXF files.
Hmmm...would this work with Avid MXF files? I don't have any to test....would be interesting to know.
Please do. I guess I could try exporting quicktime references from Avid and importing those into FCP. Yea, that'd prolly work it.
If this is just for P2 MXF, it doesn't seem like much of a find to me, there was already a system to get P2 MXF into fcp, this would almost be expected to work?
This was a find, because we were told that Apple doesn't have native P2 MXF support, yet someone found that it just worked...and we tracked down why.
The point Mat, is that people would like to slide a P2 card into the computer and just begin editing, without having to import the footage first. There are several workflows that want this...and thus far the only way to do this was with RAYLIGHT. Until now. Because this codec exists, and because Raylight can get it working, we know that it is possible to get native MXF support with FCP. WHY they haven't implimented it yet is the question.
Now, why would you want FCP to work with Avid files? Well, I know why you would, but would behoove Apple to make that possible? Why capture footage on one system to work with on another? If you want to use FCP, capture with FCP.
Oh I see, sorry I've only worked with DV tapes. I've actually decided to edit on media composer this time. I usually use final cut, but I miss Avid's trim tool! Besides, I think it'd be good if I can use both applications well, just like you do.
I don't need to use both apps for this, but it'd obviously be helpful to know how for when I might.
I notice I can also read them straight from the Quicktime player also now--just pop in a card and drag the .mxf over the QT player and check out the footage (sans audio), and just drag the folders (video-audio) into fcp from the finder and go.
thanks for passing this on. HUGE time-saver on the set for looking at clips.
Correction. Should read...
Then Wes from Automatic Duck mentioned that he could not do this...and he was running the same version.
Hi bpj,
when you drag .MXF file into quicktime the FCP, are video and audio files together? If they are separate and you had to sync them up manually, it's still better to import the files as Apple suggests, isn't it?
You don't want to sync up 50-60 rolls(cards).
cowtown,
agree completely. There is no sync and for sure wrapping them in FCP prior to edit is still the way.
All I'm pointing out is that the component is a QT component, and thus you can view (or listen) to individual clips in the QT player or wherever in QT enabled apps.
Now, one might ask why that matters. Here's where it helped me recently. I'm on a shoot and we're offloading cards to a laptop. We break and the client asks to see a particular shot. On my drive is just the card dumps. Without having to do anything else, I can drag the video.mxf clip over the QT player and show the client the clip he asked to see. I can also drag the corresponding audio clips over the QT player (i.e. the video.mxf + the 4 audio channels.mxf and hit command-return and they all play in sync (you must deselect the QT pref to only play audio on frontmost window).
Sure, nothing earthshaking, but at least I can browse through clips in a pinch. And yes, there are apps out there that allow you to do this but knowing that I can do so in Quicktime seems worth noting.
bpj
Its worked like that for quite a while.
Check this post of mine on DVXuser from september
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=108427
This could be a big help for a problem I've run into a couple of times - I'll cut and online on my Mac but farm bits of the project out to PC using After Effects compositors. The problem is they can't work with the Quicktime-wrapped MXF conversions without buying Raylight. If I can use MXFs natively = problem solved.
"The problem is they can't work with the Quicktime-wrapped MXF conversions without buying Raylight. If I can use MXFs natively = problem solved."
#1 - Does AE work with MXF files at all?
#2 - Importing MXF files in this manner means that you have to manually sync your audio. As opposed to QT import or Raylight import that ties them together.
And #3 - Raylight is for working with MXF files natively...not imported quicktimes. It is the alternative to importing MXF as QT.
I was told by another editor at work that you can play Avid media files in FCP6 if you download the Avid Meridian drivers for Mac from the Avid site.
man thank you for this! helped us a whole lot! thanks again!
I tried this in final cut 6.0.2 w p2cms 1.1.9 on an intel mac running 10.4.11 with NTSC D1 footage shot on a p2 camera that was transfered to a firewire drive.
I select one of the MXF files from within the "video" folder, and yes I can import the file into final cut, but guys.. this is a proxy. it's 640x480. hardly what i'd call native support.
CS3 After Effects DOES support MXF
Try this in after effects 8, however and we have a different story. I definitely have full MXF support in after effects. select the mxf from the video folder and it imports _with_ audio, video in its native resolution. verrrry nice.
Well, NOW it does Rob. At the time I wrote this, it didn't (December 2007. A recent update to the CS3 package made that possible.
And I won't recommend importing and working with the footage in this manner, because the Audio and Video aren't tied and you'd have to do that in FCP. You're better off importing via LOG AND TRANSFER or P2CMS or P2 Log or even Raylight.
As for them being 640x480 "proxies." Those aren't the proxies...those are THE files. 640x480 square pixels converts to 720x480 rectangular in FCP. QT and FCP read the files differently.
ps langers:
yes. but its the avid meridian CODECS you want to install (google search) NOT the drivers...
If you're using a KONA or Blackmagic card, or any media 100 hardware and you install avid drivers, you could possibly cause some problems. all you need to install are the codecs.. installing the drivers most likely also installs the codecs but you can find the codecs independent from the drivers on avid's site.
same holds true the other way around.. you can install KONA(or media 100) codecs on an avid editing machine to allow support for kona qt (or media 100)..
Shane:
Interesting. i'm not getting any automatic conversion.. are you manually adjusting the aspect ration in the motion tab to compensate for the aspect change?
when i import a NTSC D1 qt clip into final cut and look at the frame size in the project bin, i see 720x486 NTSC CCIR 601 pixel aspect.
when i import an mxf from the video folder of files transfered from a P2, the frame size in the project bin is 640x480, square pixels...
According to Apple and Panasonic, this is not the proper method to ingest P2 footage into final cut, thus the message "The following media files are not optimized for Final Cut Pro"
just FYI, NTSC D1 is 720x486, NOT 720x480.
Pardon the typo..to used to typing 720x480 because of dealing with DV.
I don't know what mumbo jumbo goes on when you import...I am a creative editor mainly, so if it works and looks good, then I am pleased. I just know that FCP is converting it from square to rectangular pixels so that it will be in the proper dimensions. This is why it is important to import properly.
I just thought it was neat that I could do that.
Shane:
it's neat, it's handy, but this is *not* native support. I hate to see threads like this contradict their purpose, and that is to learn together and educate the public of our findings.. not to waste time misleading people into accepting a flawed workflow.
I did say "sorta..."
Well, with DVCPRO HD footage, the imported clips showed up as 960x720, the exact same dimensions as the imported quicktimes. So it works properly with DVCPRO HD...just not with NTSC D1.
So...sorta.
Look at that!!!
mxf4mac.com
Further up, Shane asked if the same worked for Avid MXF files. I've tried it both ways, P2 MXF and now Avid MXF. As we know, it works with P2 MXF--and I can say it *doesn't work* for Avid MXF with FCP 6.0.4 (at least copied directly from OMFI file structure Avid creates for MXF it imports).
*But* I haven't installed the Avid meridian codecs, going to do that now and will report back.
I installed the Avid meridien (sic) codecs, and still am not having any luck.
This might be due to the fact that I'm running QT 7.5.5
Hmmmm...
Those Avid QT codecs are for the QUICKTIME exports you make from Avid...like the Avid DV codec. But since Avid doesn't capture as quicktime, but rather MXF, then those codecs won't help.
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